That Quail Place Forum

Raising Gamebirds => Buy and Sell => Topic started by: NTxBirdman on November 04, 2008, 08:38:44 AM

Title: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: NTxBirdman on November 04, 2008, 08:38:44 AM
Hello all,

Just became a member of this forum, and it looks like a great place to exchange ideas and information.  With that, I would like to share an unfortunate situation that happened to my business this year.

We decided to double up our production of quail this year to 9,000. We had been buying day-old chicks from a supplier about 200 miles from our farm, but due to the rising cost of fuel and a $1.50/mile delivery charge, we elected to order through CM Game Birds and have them shipped in. We have had stock flown in (pardon the pun) with success in the past. We ordered 4,000 birds and with freight paid roughly $2,000. When the birds arrived, 2,500 were dead in the boxes. They continued to die at the rate of 100/hour until we were left with less than 300.

We contacted CM and he told us we had to file a claim with the postal service. Turns out CM was just brokering the deal and had them shipped from a hatchery in South Dakota, and the freight spent two days in transit. We contacted the postal service and provided pictures. Of course the claim was denied because a) the boxes were not damaged and b) there were no special care instructions printed on the boxes (that's right, plain white boxes). CM has refused to provide the name of the hatchery and will not refund us the $2,000. He has since stopped returning our calls. Now we are out the initial investment, not to mention lost revenues (we estimated about $15,000). Small claims court is not an option since CM is in Maine, the hatchery is in South Dakota, and we are in the middle, both literally and figuratively. My only recourse is the BBB and to inform the good people of this board to be very careful when doing business with CM Game Birds. IMO, they have no honor.
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: CharlieHorse on November 04, 2008, 11:07:32 AM
Pitiful.

 s47


Sorry to hear of the misfortune with you and the birds.

..........and  s016


Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: mobe_45 on November 04, 2008, 05:15:02 PM
What a horrible way to do in the chicks.
I just went to the CM site. They have a highlighted statement now that they do not guarantee live chicks on delivery now. Why would anyone buy from someone when they may ship dead chicks to start with?
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: NTxBirdman on November 04, 2008, 06:14:41 PM
Well, our assumption was they were alive when they shipped, but after closer examination we noticed many chicks still had eggshell on them, which to me indicates they were packed before they even had an opportunity to dry.

I can understand the no guarantee statement, but the simple fact of the matter is there were errors in the way the birds were packaged and shipped. One can hardly blame the USPS when there are no bills of lading or special care instructions...
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: jimmurray3 on November 04, 2008, 06:39:57 PM
I think he should replace at least half of the birds and pay the shipping if he is any kind of business person and welcome to that quail place thank ya Jim  s016
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: Little Bear Game Farm on November 04, 2008, 06:49:17 PM
 s016 Thanks for the info.  Extremely unfortunate you had to find out the hard way.  Good Luck with the next season.
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: Pretty_Bird on November 04, 2008, 08:16:01 PM
Hello,
Welcome to the forum  s016.
That is a money hungry person who apparently has no concern for the birds, just wanted to make the money. Very bad business. You should tell everyone you can it may not get you your money back but it may keep him from making any!!
   A loss 1/2 that size would put me out of the game bird raising game all together and I know it is not one easily to write it off as a learning experience.

  Although I am still a rookie, when I first started raising quail I thought about buying day old birds but after reading lots of articles about them I soon changed my mind.
 It takes me a little longer to get my birds with having to incubate the eggs but the eggs survive shipping better than live birds.

Will be looking forward to reading your future posts.
Pretty_Bird

Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: slider on November 04, 2008, 08:25:07 PM
  s016 to the forum..Pitiful, pitiful, pitiful shame on CM...Very bad business practices..They should be put out of business.
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: Pheasant Hollow Farm on November 05, 2008, 04:35:00 AM
NTxBirdman,  s016 to That Quail Place.

Strombergs is the same way. If you order live birds or eggs from them, they call their suppliers and the suppliers will drop ship from their location with the stromberg address lable.

Steve
Pheasant Hollow Farm
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: NTxBirdman on November 05, 2008, 07:18:36 AM
Thanks for the warm welcome everybody....

Thankfully that was not my only shipment of birds for the season. I already had 3,500 just coming out of the brooder when this happened. I was also able to locate another supplier and although it cost quite a bit more, I got some two week old birds to make up part of the loss. My stock is now around 5,000, which is still an increase over last year. We've also added 1,000 pheasant for this season, and have started guided hunts on our lease pasture, so with some hard work and a little luck we should be okay. But it is one heck of a hickey to take...

We already have a supplier lined up for next season. They will deliver to my door, which means they are responsible for the bird's welfare until they arrive.

Lesson learned - don't try to save a few dollars when buying day-old's. If you have a reliable source and are happy with the stock then stick with them. It could cost you thousands of dollars, and as Slider said, maybe even your business. 
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: slider on November 05, 2008, 09:14:36 AM
Well the best to you NTx and I think the KEY words in your reply are HARD WORK on your part.
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: wildergamebirds on November 05, 2008, 11:35:37 AM
Lesson learned - don't try to save a few dollars when buying day-old's. If you have a reliable source and are happy with the stock then stick with them. It could cost you thousands of dollars, and as Slider said, maybe even your business. 

  You don't need to be scolded, and that's not my intent.

  Old sayings become old sayings, for a reason.  They fit many situations over a span of many years.  My old pappy's version was "It runs good, don't  F*** with it."

  Actually, I think you can file in small claims court, there.  If not, your consumer protection division might take it on, with the idea that "damned foreigners" took advantage of local folks.

  With delivery, as you know, most of us charge for the number of live birds delivered.  You may end up with no extras, but you don't get reamed.

  I assume NTx is North Texas.  Do you care to narrow it down for us?

  Stick around, here, maybe one of us can help, next time.
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: NTxBirdman on November 05, 2008, 11:57:57 AM

  You don't need to be scolded, and that's not my intent.

  Old sayings become old sayings, for a reason.  They fit many situations over a span of many years.  My old pappy's version was "It runs good, don't  F*** with it."

  Actually, I think you can file in small claims court, there.  If not, your consumer protection division might take it on, with the idea that "damned foreigners" took advantage of local folks.

  With delivery, as you know, most of us charge for the number of live birds delivered.  You may end up with no extras, but you don't get reamed.

  I assume NTx is North Texas.  Do you care to narrow it down for us?

  Stick around, here, maybe one of us can help, next time.

Thanks for the advice. I will definately look into it...

As far as location, I'm roughly 60 miles northeast of Dallas.
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: greyghost on November 08, 2008, 12:04:46 AM
I do not know if this will help, but ........... I lost her email. if you go to ebay " hatching eggs" for Northern Bobwhites and the seller reads Lady-Di-one she is an outstanding seller. Her real name is Diane Grice. I believe she is in Tennesee. She has alot of birds and sells alot of eggs. I have purchased from her three times and not one broken egg and always extras.
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: birddog on November 08, 2008, 01:38:33 PM
does anyone have a website for this cm in maine? I am in maine and do not want to get mixed up with this guy. I found cm gamebirds on the web but their phone # is tenn. ??
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: NTxBirdman on November 09, 2008, 06:23:52 AM
does anyone have a website for this cm in maine? I am in maine and do not want to get mixed up with this guy. I found cm gamebirds on the web but their phone # is tenn. ??

Yes, it's game-birds.net.
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: NTxBirdman on November 09, 2008, 06:27:48 AM
I do not know if this will help, but ........... I lost her email. if you go to ebay " hatching eggs" for Northern Bobwhites and the seller reads Lady-Di-one she is an outstanding seller. Her real name is Diane Grice. I believe she is in Tennesee. She has alot of birds and sells alot of eggs. I have purchased from her three times and not one broken egg and always extras.

Thank you for the info greyghost. I will definately keep that in mind.
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: Jake Levi on November 09, 2008, 06:56:17 AM

Welcome to the Forum.    s016

I've never heard of this place but they need to be shut down.

Contact the  Maine Attorney General plus the Better Business Bureau there.

And please post this also on the vendor feedback section if you havent already.

Just copy and paste to there.

I'd also be preparing whatever suit is possible.

I'm sorry this happened, it was rotten business.

Thanks for sharing, hang in there, we need folks like you.
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: NTxBirdman on November 09, 2008, 04:17:20 PM
Thanks Jake, I'll do that...
Title: Re: How NOT to buy birds...
Post by: greyghost on November 09, 2008, 07:32:29 PM
Birdman, Diane is in Clio, Alabama. My brain takes a while, but it will kick into gear...............................Sometime.