Future game bird farming & Experience

[Pheasant Hollow Farm]

Okay, with the hatching season winding down for the most of us, what have you accepted as a reasonable loss. This question will relate to eggs for collection, hatch, and young birds.

1-   6 hatches from mid March thru mid July.
2-   The total egg counts were, 2,136 for Ring-necked Pheasant and 150, Melanistic Mutant Pheasant.
3-   1,315 Ring-necked Pheasants that hatched
4-   120 Melanistic Mutant Pheasants that hatched

I had more eggs that were not fertile then I did with the chicks not hatching out and dieing in the shell. Total trashed eggs were 821. Given the fact that my hens are 3 years old, I can accept the non-fertile eggs. I had also lost 10-3 year old hens due to egg bound and blowout.

The chick loses were mainly with in the first 2 weeks after the hatch. I use a section of the barn as a brooder that is 8’ x 16’ and 7 foot in height.

Weather conditions this year were not the best. Loses to CRD was better the 15% on the first hatch. Second hatch showed loses to CRD was also in the 15% range.

The other 4 hatches were about 3% loses due to weather conditions and no CRD was noted.

So out of total 1,315 RN’s and 120 Mel’s that hatched, I have to date RN’s 1057 and 91 Mel’s all these birds range in age from 6-17 weeks of age.

Now the other question to be asking.

Will I raise in production quantity again?  Unless I have a substantial amount of capital for next year, (I am already in the red for better than $4500.00) for the electric, feed, meds and water, and the amount of time invested (over 8 hours a day). I seriously doubt it. This is one task that cannot be done by one individual alone.  

Did I learn from my experience? Yes, even though all my birds are contracted to a shooting preserve, this is absolutely not a part time adventure with out a full time staff.

Steve
Pheasant Hollow Farm

[magnumhntr]

I'm in partnership with a friend of mine, so I have a little more help. Also, we primarily deal with selling chicks. We raise about 400 up to adults, keeping breeders for next year, selling a few cocks and unneeded hens to help out with prices, and releasing the rest for personal shooting.

We set 2800 eggs this year, and hatched 1850, about 65%. I noticed our hatch rates were alot lower this year compared to years past. The last 3 years we hatched between 70 and 75% on any given hatch. This year we also had a big problem with egg eaters.

We've got our brooding pretty much down to a science, but we're on a little smaller scale than you when it come to amount of chick brooded at once. But, we still had a 2-3% loss of chicks, which from my experience is pretty standard, as you will always lose a few.

My biggest losses this year were after putting the birds in the flight pen @ 6 wks and having them come down with gapeworms. Lost 42 birds before figuring out what was causing it.

Problem with pheasants is that you need SO MUCH space to raise them in. In my case, the money is in the chicks. Next year we'll hatch and sell over 4000 chicks, and probably 6000 quail. Gonna also raise up some quail to sell, as they are not so space dependant as pheasants.

And you are right about the time involved. For me this is a hobby that is slowly turning into a side job. But I do make a little extra money that helps pay for all my hunting and fishing excursions, and also puts a little in the bank. Plus raising birds is something I enjoy, and that helps too :-)

[casnj]

I have 3 acers , and was thinking about raising quail and eggs. It would be mainly to restaurants.  But there is also a privite game preserve near by, they release bobwhites, for their hunters.  I would be starting small scale. And I am just in the begining to look into my market potential. Any help would be appreciated

[ridgetop]

STEVE,

THOUGHT I WOULD LET YOU KNOW THE UPDATE ON WV GAMEBIRDS.ANY BIRD RELATED TO THE PHEASANT,PARTRIDGE OR QUAIL FAMILY IS CONSIDERED A GAMEBIRD IN THE STATE OF WV.IT DOES NOT MATTER IF IT IS MUTANTS GOLDENS REEVES ETC..SAME FOR QUAIL AND ALL TYPES OF PARTRIDGE.ALSO IF A PERSON WWANTS TO HUNT ANY OF THESE OUT OF SEANSON WITH DOGS THEN A SHOOT TO RETRIEVE PERMIT IS NEEDED.........THEY MAKE THINGS HARDER ON US ALL THE TIME..FOR CHUKAR THEY SAID IF THEY WANTED TO GET TECH ABOUT IT ANYTHING THAT DOES NOT HAVE A SEASON ON IT MEANS IT IS PROTECTED..........

[Pheasant Hollow Farm]

ridgetop,

STEVE,

THOUGHT I WOULD LET YOU KNOW THE UPDATE ON WV GAMEBIRDS.ANY BIRD RELATED TO THE PHEASANT,PARTRIDGE OR QUAIL FAMILY IS CONSIDERED A GAMEBIRD IN THE STATE OF WV.IT DOES NOT MATTER IF IT IS MUTANTS GOLDENS REEVES ETC..SAME FOR QUAIL AND ALL TYPES OF PARTRIDGE.ALSO IF A PERSON WWANTS TO HUNT ANY OF THESE OUT OF SEANSON WITH DOGS THEN A SHOOT TO RETRIEVE PERMIT IS NEEDED.........THEY MAKE THINGS HARDER ON US ALL THE TIME..FOR CHUKAR THEY SAID IF THEY WANTED TO GET TECH ABOUT IT ANYTHING THAT DOES NOT HAVE A SEASON ON IT MEANS IT IS PROTECTED..........

Yes you are right, all the game birds that you listed are considered game birds in this state, for licensing game bird farm's purposes only.

Hunting season dates on the native game birds, Ring-necked Pheasant, Bob white Quail, and the Ruffed Grouse in the new hunting and trapping regulations do not state sub species, or Chukar’s. http://www.wvdnr.gov/hunting/pdf/SEASONSDATESLIMITS.PDF

Where did you get this information? If it is in the new regulations of title 58csr64 I haven't gotten a copy of it yet.

They cannot make or change any of these rules when they feel like it. The DNR cannot make or list any game bird protected. It has to fit into a certain criteria under federal guidelines, it is not considered as an owl, hawk, eagle or an insectivorous songbird, and since all sub species along with the Chukar are not indigenous to this state, they cannot make or create hunting season dates for something that doesn’t exist.

If it is not in title 58csr64 someone is yanking your chain. I have challenged them before and I will do it again.

You got my phone number, give me a call.

Steve
Pheasant Hollow Farm

[ridgetop]

STEVE,

THE DNR OFFICERS THAT COME CHECK OUT MY BIRDS,TOLD ME THIS,PLUS I CONTACTED THE DNR OFFICE IN ELKINS,SPOKE WITH LT.DELLEMA. THET CLAIM ONCE A GAMEBIRD IS RELEASED NO MATTER WHERE IT BECOMES THE STATES AND TO SHOOT IT YOU NEED A PERMIT.I THINK IT IS A WAY TO GET MORE MONEY OFF FOLKS..I DO NOT HAVE THE NEW REGULATIONS BUT THEY SAID IT WAS IN THERE,SO I GUESS WE WILL SEE..I HOPE THAT YOU ARE RIGHT.....

[Pheasant Hollow Farm]

ridgetop,

THE DNR OFFICERS THAT COME CHECK OUT MY BIRDS,TOLD ME THIS,PLUS I CONTACTED THE DNR OFFICE IN ELKINS,SPOKE WITH LT.DELLEMA. THET CLAIM ONCE A GAMEBIRD IS RELEASED NO MATTER WHERE IT BECOMES THE STATES AND TO SHOOT IT YOU NEED A PERMIT.I THINK IT IS A WAY TO GET MORE MONEY OFF FOLKS..I DO NOT HAVE THE NEW REGULATIONS BUT THEY SAID IT WAS IN THERE,SO I GUESS WE WILL SEE..I HOPE THAT YOU ARE RIGHT.....

Here is the emergency amendment to an emergency rule regarding title 58 CSR 64

http://www.wvsos.com/adlaw/proposed/58-64era.pdf

Steve
Pheasant Hollow Farm

[ridgetop]

Steve,

Thanks for the link...Look under section 2.11 what does that really mean?They also told me if I use a Johnny house for my bobwhites once I release them.They actually become the states and for me to recall them,it would be considered trapping,they did say that they probably could over look that one!

[Pheasant Hollow Farm]

ridgetop,

Steve,Thanks for the link...Look under section 2.11 what does that really mean?They also told me if I use a Johnny house for my bobwhites once I release them.They actually become the states and for me to recall them,it would be considered trapping,they did say that they probably could over look that one!

2.11 means that all wild game birds that are indigenous to the State of WV and all non-indigenous wild game birds that are either raised or imported into WV by a licensed game bird breeder is still considered WILD GAME BIRDS.

I would also go on the assumption that this would include all sub-species of “grouse, partridges, pheasants, quail, and waterfowl.

Well, I guess the Johnny house could be classified as a trap. Since you are releasing them into the wild for either propagation or hunting, and using the Johnny house as a recall pen at the end of the day. If I were you, I would band all the birds that you release. This way, if they do see the recall pen they can’t say you are recalling wild Bobwhite Quail. You can also tell them that you are using the Johnny house as a transfer pen for the following days release. This way they can’t bag you for trapping the birds, since all birds in the Johnny house are banded.

I do not recapture any pheasants that I release. I do put on the DNR-LE-33B “ I Reserve the Right to Retrieve or Capture Birds that have escaped.” This is on my property only. The birds that escape and are off my property, I consider that as becoming the property of the state.

I have not run into any problems doing this.

Here is another thing that I have done. I have signed release forms from many local farms in my area that I release birds on during different times of the year.
I send in a copy to the DNR office and I also do a survey during the growth periods of the birds that I release. I use my dogs to find, hold, and flush. All birds that I release have colored bands which makes it easy to tell their age, and where they wound up.

I do not get any field trial permit or any type of permit to do this. Again, I have never had a problem either.

Now, once again the issue of hunting wild game birds that are not listed on the hunting season regulations. Since there is no season dates on Chukar’s, sub-species quail, sub-species pheasants, if you were to hunt them on your property in an open field I wouldn’t worry about any permit.

The field trials permit requires a minimum of one judge and more then one contestant.

The Shoot-to-Retrieve Field Trial permit again requires a minimum of one judge and more then one contestant.

So you see, as long as you are not in the woods with a firearm when hunting season is closed, you can legally be in open fields, meadows.

Another point of interest, WV has a 2 cock Ring-necked Pheasant limit per day state wide, except at Hillcrest Wild Life Management Area, which is one cock bird per day. You cannot shoot the Ring-necked Pheasant hens. The Ring-necked Pheasant includes, Chinese, Manchurian, and Blue backs, Jumbo Ring-necks, Buffed Pheasant.

Your Melanistic Mutant, Afghan Whitewing, White, Reeves, Golden, Lady Amhearst, Silver, Dark throated Golden, Yellow Golden, Red Golden, can all be hunted year round, this also includes the hens and there is no daily bag or season limit.

This would be the same for all grouse (excluding the Ruffed Grouse) that is not indigenous to WV. The same thing for all the different breeds of Quail excluding the Bobwhite Quail of course.

Steve
Pheasant Hollow Farm 

[ridgetop]

Steve,

Thanks for the info..I had a go around with one of the officers today,not about my birds..but I asked the same thing you were telling me about the mutants and whitewings..he said as long as it is in the pheasnt,partridge,quail family then tes you have to follow the rules..no excepetions..I guess i will need to get a new law book and read what it really says..

[ridgetop]

steve,
what type of birds do you sell? And prices!! I misplaced ur email and phone number I have been looking for it.you can email me at setters1973@yahoo.com..thanks

[Pheasant Hollow Farm]

ridgetop,

Steve,

Thanks for the info..I had a go around with one of the officers today,not about my birds..but I asked the same thing you were telling me about the mutants and whitewings..he said as long as it is in the pheasnt,partridge,quail family then tes you have to follow the rules..no excepetions..I guess i will need to get a new law book and read what it really says..

It never ceases to amaze me how some of these DNR Officer’s think they are GOD . I would like to talk to this Ill informed person. It seems that he doesn’t know his a$$ from a Whole in the ground.

Next time you see him show him the Hunting Regulation Syllabus, 2005-2006 regarding Ruffed Grouse and the Ring Necked Pheasant and the Bob White Quail. then ask him where it states the season dates and limits on the other game birds that you raise or any other breeders raise. Then show him the Legislative rules and Regulations Title 58 CSR 64 and Title 58 CSR 63.  Since there are no rules how can there be any exceptions?

I just love it when these clowns don’t know what they are talking about.

Steve
Pheasant Hollow Farm