Red tailed Hawks and Owls

[tanaro2]

  Rabbit populations go in cycles  the fact is Red Tailed hawks prey more on mice than any other prey species.  Another fact is.. Red tails are not very succesfull at catching rabbits.  They miss more than they connect.  Rabbit populations are scarcely (and I do mean scarcely) affected by birds of prey.   If you are finding headless rabbits than you are talking about the wrong predator.  The head is the last thing a hawk will eat.  They will go through the softest part of the body.  More often than not they will start from the anal area and work into the lungs and heart. Now if you were worried about the mole, vole, and rat population then I could see your concern.  Coopers hawks are much to small to consistantly take a rabbit so that rules them out.  Also, if you think that the hawks, especially the Red Tailed is hurting the population of wild game birds then you are misinformed.  Red Tails will rarely if ever chase a wild game bird that is not injured or sick.  Too much energy to burn, and often ending in failure.  They much rather sit on a telephone pole looking for field mice and such.  Why should they lift a ban on Birds of Prey??  The reason why there was a ban in the first place is because misinformed farmers and such were shooting them down left and right untill the numbers were in serious jepardy.  Its pretty apparent that some people still think this way, and thus the ban is still in place.  What I meant by the high mortality rate is this.  A coyotee is more to blame for rabbit and game bird populations than the Hawks.  A coyotte will have a litter of several pups and most will survive.  Most RTH will only have 1-2 chicks make it out of the nest.  Out of 10 birds that successfully left the nest in your state, only 3 will make it through the winter on average.  Thus the ban.  If the ban was lifted and people were allow to kill the birds then it wouldn't be long before they would drasticly decline.  There would be more being killed off then the bird can recover from.  I understand your distress if you are having some of your penned birds being pegged by hawks.  I wouldn't be to happy either.  But keep in mind, when you present a situation like that, its like ringing the dinner bell for all predators.  Hunters kill more Game birds than Hawks, coyotees, skunks, weasels and racoons combined on a yearly basis.  I don't know if you sell any of your game birds or not but I do know that thousands of Falconers order from alot of Gamebird Breeders year round.  Just wouldn't make good buisness sense to be talking about killing off hawks.  Sure, there are some bans that are far outdated and need to be lifted, but the ban on killing birds of prey is not one of them.  Too many stupid and careless people out there that shoot them for the hell of it.  Lift the ban and you will have more idiots stopping by every tenth pole you mentioned, taking pot shots at them because they think its fun.  That is where the problem is.  Not on the people trying to protect their poultry and such, but the ones who are morons, who think shooting Hawks out of the sky or on poles is funny.   Maybe you can see my point of view.

[La.bowhunter]

i agree more than any of you know me my self will be a licenced falconry soon and if you think that a 22 or a 17 cal is what you need to fix a hawk you a retard and maybe need to shove those up your A$$ to get the picture here and that swgt you have you shouldn't because those are only to be use in the sport of falconry not for some hick farmer to use to catch and kill valuable birds of prey and i hope you lose business for saying some thing stupid like that all you inbreed bastard that use leg hold traps on post sit on them cause your worth less and i hope some one nock some sense into you and learn you fact before you open your hick mouth

right or wrong thats not needed here.

[pamike]

Yo,

I didn't read all of this topic yet, But I am 100% sure you went a little overboard on that last post. I understand that you are passionate about falconry but there is no need to call names on here or any other forum for that matter. You might want to tone it down a bit and edit your post befor someone does it for you. A little restraint in how you use your words will get you further ahead. I read your reply and all I remembered after about 2 minutes was the derogatory comments. I am not a moderator or an administrator of this forum, But I am the administrator on another forum. I absolutely will not tolerate that kind of behavior there. I am not trying to embarass you or yell at you, I am just trying to give you some advice on how these forums are usually run.

mike

[pamike]

Yo, Now that I have had a chance to read the entire subject, I stand by what I said before. I only saw a few people "suggesting" leghold traps or shooting the birds. I did not see where anyone said that is thier actual method. I do not agree with harming endangered species, but I believe that we have an obligation to our birds to protect them from predators whether they be furred or feathered. Our birds very survival depend on us protecting them until the day that we sell, or eat them ourselves. We also have an obligation to our families to protect thier livelihood and/or food supply. I will be building my pens in an area where there are possible predators, however I can easily deal with the land animals. I have no doubt that I can deal with the birds of prey around be. There are some owls, hawks and at least one osprey in my area. My best defense will be prevention. I will be using some of that tackless stripping for carpets anywhere the birds might want to land. If one lands on that stuff one it will not want to again. I used to lay carpet and I know for a fact that stuff hurts like hell. That is just one idea, I know we can come up with more legal ideas.

mike

[CharlieHorse]

pamike,

  I'll have to say that is the first time that I personally have seen such a childish, unlegable, derogatory post on this forum. I think they should be banned from the site. That's out of control.

  Hopefully the whole thread doesn't get deleted because of some idiot. 

  On the other hand, your statement about using carpet tack strips reminded me of some stainless steel spike strips that I was hired to install on the City building ledges with my bucket truck to control pigeons. These strips were about 3' long and had about 4" stainless "needles" sticking out in every direction. The City had purchased them, so I don't know the cost of them. The springy wires were so thin that they weren't even noticeable from the ground. Just a 2 inch piece cut off would be plenty for the top of a post. So, if a person could acquire just one 3' strip, it would go along way on posts. It hurt me just to look at it! Needless to say................no more pigeons!!
 

[Pheasant Hollow Farm]

i agree more than any of you know me my self will be a licenced falconry soon and if you think that a 22 or a 17 cal is what you need to fix a hawk you a retard and maybe need to shove those up your A$$ to get the picture here and that swgt you have you shouldn't because those are only to be use in the sport of falconry not for some hick farmer to use to catch and kill valuable birds of prey and i hope you lose business for saying some thing stupid like that all you inbreed bastard that use leg hold traps on post sit on them cause your worth less and i hope some one nock some sense into you and learn you fact before you open your hick mouth

What we have here is a failure to communicate.  This little individual, 14Yoquailfarmer, should be spending more time learning his communication skills in school, and being in bed by 9pm. 

Steve
Pheasant Hollow Farm

pamike,

  I'll have to say that is the first time that I personally have seen such a childish, unlegable, derogatory post on this forum. I think they should be banned from the site. That's out of control.

  Hopefully the whole thread doesn't get deleted because of some idiot. 

I have been a member of this site for as long as I can remember, and through 3 BB changes when this was own by Shawn. We have lost valued long time member’s over the years due to the influx of immature adolescence.

I do hope that Larry the new site owner will stamp this members ticket cancelled and send him/her on his/her way, and remove his/her post in this topic.

Steve
Pheasant Hollow Farm

[jchiar]

Steve ,sounds like a game plan to me

[Pheasant Hollow Farm]

Ahhhhhhh, someone just took my karma away John! Welll what do ya know, I guess the truth hurts. How long before my karma drops again?

John, looks like rain here with t-storms during the day. No hawks around and all the young birds are doing fine.

How is it in your neck of the woods?

Steve
Pheasant Hollow Farm

[jchiar]

I'm in nj working supposed to hit high 70's today and sunny.i guess my karma is going down the tubes ,truth hurts    who is the little nit -wit that posted the tirade??? oops there  goes another point 

[CharlieHorse]

LOL!!  I guess that a few of us are in the same boat! My Karma keeps going down hill too.  I hope this doesn't get to the point that no one will read my post because of my "negative feedback"?  LOL!  I hope that I don't make anybody else mad!   Geeeezzzz!   LOL!

I'm glad that I'm not alone!

Thanks!

Now back to the birds.....................................

[pamike]

although this is mikes user id this is mike's wife mary replying this time. i time to time visit this forum on mike's thing so hello to all cause i haven't said much on here and i really like this forum i'm learning alot and i thank you for haveing us here. now with all that said...

 i have been watching some of the stuff going on. i must say i am appauled at all of this. joey i want to know if you kiss your mom with that mouth? if that was my 14 year old you would be in some serious trouble for talking to adults or anyone for that matter like that. it is childish. i have 5 kids from 2-10 and none of them are or would ever talk like that to someone else. it is down right dissrespectful and your mother should have taught you if you don't have something nice to say then keep it to yourself.

you are blameing others for reccomended ideas to void unwanted preditors i find that funny since you are a trapper you are no better. i personally am a trapper and i find it embaraseing as a fellow trapper to know there are trappers out there like you.  people like you is what gives us trappers a bad name. have you ever stopped to think of the way we have to put down animals trapping? it's not nice nor pretty but it's not wrong either and it is leagal and sometimes necisary that we must do it.

trapping is done as a means for me as food, clothing and money. sometimes it's the only way i have to get my kid's stuff for christmas or clothes and such but it's what i have to do for us to make it. these people are trying to make a liveing, feed their family or what have you everyone has their reasons. in order to hunt live or raise anything you need to learn respect for yourself, the animals, protecting the animals and respect your fellow people. without that noone has that right to hunt, trap or raise an animal ect.

i love animals especially birds and noone that i know of loves and protects them as much as i do. i understand your frustrations but let me tell you something. a prediter is just that i don't care what it is. my family depends on my chicks or birds for food so if that means i have to trap something or what not i'm gonna do it. i don't care what your beliefs are and you will never change that and i'm sure many would agree. people come first, then pets and livestock or whatever we have to have food to live and prediters are way at the bottom no matter what it is. so you need to learn what priorities are more important. your beliefs or protecting your family and the food chain.

do you mean to tell me if you were starving to death and all you had was like 3 chickens to eat you would rather die of starveing to death than for you to protect your only food supply from a hawk or an other prediter? um ok if you would rather starve to death than boy there is something seriously wrong with you. sit and think seriously about what you have said. it does not make sence and you are in a fantacy world. these people are kind enough to help others out where as you are only being selfish. i am totally for protecting wildlife especially endangered ones but like others have said there are other means to control them when they are out of control. had you paid attention you would have seen we all want what's best to protect all of them noone is purposely doing anything or sugesting killing them. 
thanks for letting me rant i hope i didn't offend anyone,
mary

[ChrisCarreiro]

14Yoquailfarmer,

  I have been a member for about 2 months on this forum, and this is the only forum i have been on where people are respectful towards one another whether they know eachother or not. Everyone is polite, friendly, and happy to help. Everyone has their own way of doing things, this type of hobby is individualized for lack of a better word. It is molded to your interest, you might not like what someone suggests, but its just a suggestion that they have most likely used and it worked for them. So dont jump down their throat for wanting to help. Personally after that atttack you made, i dont think anyone will want to help you anymore. You talk to us like we are trash, and that is what you will be treated like. If you want respect you have to earn it. I think you owe an apology to this forum there buddy!

Chris

[14Yoquailfarmer]

all ready did 

[PSUQuailer]

Can anyone explain to me what happened hear.  If you don't want to thats fine but i can't understand what happened.

[sp2207]

Look back about 13 posts