That Quail Place Forum
Production and Business => Propagation - Advanced Science => Topic started by: popsjp on April 09, 2007, 07:41:33 AM
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Hello everyone, I am new to the forum and new to the Quail. Have read some great information on the site. My question .... Have any of you used the surragator from "quail restoration tech."? I have a small place in central Texas that I am going to try it on. Would sure like to hear do's and don't before starting in May. The drought in that area the last 2 years has really taken its tole on the quail, hoping I can give them a jump start on recovering with this thing. Thanks J. P.
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While I have not used one, the reports I have heard have not been good.
If you have drought problems, that would concern me. Is the habitat able to sustain the quail? Water, feed and cover?
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There are three surface ponds on the property. Habitat is an ongoing improvement. Over the last year brush piles and half cutting of the trees. Food plots and native grasses have been planted and will continue. There are some deer feeders and quail feeders across the property. I have some nipple waters and will be building some waters and placing with some feeders around the release sites, with brush piles. Anything else that you could suggest? J. P.
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Here is a link to the some information Missouri has about its restoration progam for quail.
Hopefully it might help you not re-invent the wheel.
http://www.mdc.mo.gov/landown/wild/quail/
John
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Thanks John, some good information. I have been reading and trying to develope my game plan for over a year now. Mother Nature hasn't exactly been helping. J. P. Gregory
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All It is a Recall Pen that my father has been building for over 40 years. I started building them about 15 years ago and used them as a covey base camp type deal with no funnel.
with a brooder system in it You can Build your own for a fraction of the cost
3 sheets ply-wood 8 2x4s and some hardware cloth. regular light recepticals and brooder lights are a lot cheaper than a LP system
(http://www.plantationquailhunting.com/images/aabrooder.jpg)
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I started my program May 19 and think it will be good after I learn the do's and don'ts. Started with 125 day old bw chicks. Lost about half the first week. This is due to the baby chicks not being able to reach the bottom of the feed trough. No losses since they have grown some. The heater is a thermostatically controlled propane system, the waterer is gravity flow nipple system. It is basically a brooder on one side and a open pen one the other side that can be divided.
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J.P.
We are on almost the same schedule as you. Three of my buddies and I built four of these surrogators based on the QRT original out of 24 ga metal and expanded metal. They turned out really well.
We built our nipple waterers from nipples purchased at FarmTek.com and PVC pipe.
We built our LP heaters from Gas Valves purchased off the internet. (Couldn't find an extension cord long enough or a receptacle to put it in where we have the boxes.)
The only thing we are doing a little different is taking day old birds and putting them in a brooderhouse for 2 weeks so we can make sure everything goes well. Then we put the two week old birds in the surrogator boxes. We band the the birds before releasing them.
We placed our first batch of 2 wk old birds in on May 14. We have the second batch in the brooder house right now and will put them in when we release the surrogator birds.
One of my buddies already released half his birds the other day hoping they would stay around the ones that remained in the box while finding the water and food around it. Then when the rest are released their buddies can show them where the groceries and drinks are.
So far we've learned that we need to:
1. Grind the feed and place it on saucers the first week or two.
2. Medicate the water.
3. Monitor the heat in the surrogator
On the first batch we just lifted the divider about four inches and let them go back and forth. The divider helped keep some of the heat in the box when we opened it partially.
We hope to release 4 separate batches from each box between now and Sept. 23.
We are learning as we go. Can't believe it's so addictive.
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J.P.
We are on almost the same schedule as you. Three of my buddies and I built four of these surrogators based on the QRT original out of 24 ga metal and expanded metal. They turned out really well.
We built our nipple waterers from nipples purchased at FarmTek.com and PVC pipe.
We built our LP heaters from Gas Valves purchased off the internet. (Couldn't find an extension cord long enough or a receptacle to put it in where we have the boxes.)
The only thing we are doing a little different is taking day old birds and putting them in a brooderhouse for 2 weeks so we can make sure everything goes well. Then we put the two week old birds in the surrogator boxes. We band the the birds before releasing them.
We placed our first batch of 2 wk old birds in on May 14. We have the second batch in the brooder house right now and will put them in when we release the surrogator birds.
One of my buddies already released half his birds the other day hoping they would stay around the ones that remained in the box while finding the water and food around it. Then when the rest are released their buddies can show them where the groceries and drinks are.
So far we've learned that we need to:
1. Grind the feed and place it on saucers the first week or two.
2. Medicate the water.
3. Monitor the heat in the surrogator
On the first batch we just lifted the divider about four inches and let them go back and forth. The divider helped keep some of the heat in the box when we opened it partially.
We hope to release 4 separate batches from each box between now and Sept. 23.
We are learning as we go. Can't believe it's so addictive.
When you really get into it start thinking about a second job or a second mortgage!
Steve
Pheasant Hollow Farm
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J.P.
We are on almost the same schedule as you. Three of my buddies and I built four of these surrogators based on the QRT original out of 24 ga metal and expanded metal. They turned out really well.
We built our nipple waterers from nipples purchased at FarmTek.com and PVC pipe.
We built our LP heaters from Gas Valves purchased off the internet. (Couldn't find an extension cord long enough or a receptacle to put it in where we have the boxes.)
The only thing we are doing a little different is taking day old birds and putting them in a brooderhouse for 2 weeks so we can make sure everything goes well. Then we put the two week old birds in the surrogator boxes. We band the the birds before releasing them.
We placed our first batch of 2 wk old birds in on May 14. We have the second batch in the brooder house right now and will put them in when we release the surrogator birds.
One of my buddies already released half his birds the other day hoping they would stay around the ones that remained in the box while finding the water and food around it. Then when the rest are released their buddies can show them where the groceries and drinks are.
So far we've learned that we need to:
1. Grind the feed and place it on saucers the first week or two.
2. Medicate the water.
3. Monitor the heat in the surrogator
On the first batch we just lifted the divider about four inches and let them go back and forth. The divider helped keep some of the heat in the box when we opened it partially.
We hope to release 4 separate batches from each box between now and Sept. 23.
We are learning as we go. Can't believe it's so addictive.
CAN YOU SHARE SOME PICS
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I'll try to remember to take a camera tomorrow when we move one.
-D
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Releasing Bobs:
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Inside view:
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Outside View
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good pic thanks,
they are very helpful would you share the dimentions.
How many chick do you place on them?
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Sounds great. Where are you located? Next cycle I hope to start with one week old chicks, depends on what my supplier has on hand at the time. Having trouble inserting pics. I built a cage to put mine in since it is made of plastic. This hopefully will keep hogs from tearing it up getting at the chicks. I am hoping to run 5 cycles this year and see how it goes. Next time the feed trough will have a slight modification, (from slits cut in it), that will allow the small chicks to reach some of the feed.
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rsolis,
Dimensions are 4'WX8'LX16"deep. Closed end is 4X4 and so is the expanded metal end.
We put 125 in at a time. We are considering uping that another 20 to 25.
J.P.,
We're in NW OK.
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THANKS FOR THE INFORMATION,
DOES THE LP HEATER HAS A COVER ? IT IS NOT CLEAR ON THE PIC.
DO YOU HAVE THE DIMENTIONS ON THE FEEDER, HOW MUCH LBS YOU CAN PLACE
regards
Rodrigo
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Yes, the burner is covered with a piece of aluminum plate then we stuck a terra cotta saucer over that. We opted not to purchase the $45 ceramic disk.
I'm not sure what the dimensions are but it will hold two 50# bags of 28% game bird starter.
-D
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thank you for the information
I have another question regarding the watering sys. I notice that you have 2 tubing ataches to the PVC pipe. why?
thanks
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Redneck ingenuity!
One tube connects to a barbed fitting on the water barrel (water inlet)
The other is just a vent tube to let any trapped air out. We tape it to a electric fence post so it is higher than the water level of the barrel. That way we don't have any trapped air in the waterer. Oh, and the vent tube also shows us how much water we have left in the barrel.
-D
thank you for the information
I have another question regarding the watering sys. I notice that you have 2 tubing ataches to the PVC pipe. why?
thanks
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Popsjp,
How's your first batch of birds getting along?
-D
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I have more questions every time I look at your pictures.
Do you know the brand and model numbers of the gas valve, and burner?
What is the BTU rating of the burner?
Is it just a single flame, similar to a bunson burner?
Is there a way to adjust the temperature from outside, as the chicks get older?
Is the waterer height adjustable?
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I have more questions every time I look at your pictures.
Do you know the brand and model numbers of the gas valve, and burner?
Gas Valve: Robertshaw 710-203 (or a Robertshaw 710-205, with an LP Pressure Regulator Robertshaw1751-013) Burner was made by my buddy with a drilled and tapped piece of cold roll with a mig welding tip screwed into it. Don't ask me about the burner, I'm still wondering how he did it.
What is the BTU rating of the burner?
It is homemade. No BTU's known.
Is it just a single flame, similar to a bunson burner?
The flame is very similar to a chemistry class bunson burner. However the pilot light (Robertshaw 1980-036) stays lit all the time.
Is there a way to adjust the temperature from outside, as the chicks get older?
Nope, you have to raise the lid to get to the adjustment on the gas valve. We make a little noise when we lift the lid, the birds run to the expanded metal end, then we close the divider down. That way we have the inside of the box all to ourselves.
Is the waterer height adjustable?
You bet! It is hung with a light chain from the top of the box. We start it low then raise it by taking up some links in the chain.
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Just an update. Went to the ranch on June 15 with the intent of setting my first batch loose and starting the second round. The surragator had one live bird left in it. The rest were dead all around the unit. The one surviving bird wasn't looking great so I dispatced her, worried about disease. I had contacted the maker of the unit about my losses. Was told the sometimes the feed trough baffle slides down. His suggestion was to place 3/4" blocks under the baffle to prevent this. After cleaning the unit I placed the blocks under the baffle as directed and watched my second batch of birds. they seemed to be having trouble getting at the feed. My fix was to drill several 1/2" holes through the baffle that allow the feed to fall into the trough. I also started with 2 week old chicks this time. Had a hard 1-1/2" driving rain about 3am on morning, with a cool front, about 65 degrees. Checked birds that morning, lost 4. There were 6 others that were wet, placed them under the heater and checked about 2 hours later and all were dry and moving well. The next morning I had lost 2 more, Guess they were some of the wet ones? Hope this batch does better than the first. That was very disappointing. I hope that learning and success improve quickly.
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anyone try the surrogator in pa yet? successful?
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I also thought the advertised one was too pricey, I'd really like to see the plans or just more info posted on the home made ones though.
Actually I will be almost doing that in feeding my released birds, I am hoping to get a couple coveys established right here at home . I'll just open a pen door and have a couple feeders close by. There will be immediate cover nearby.
I have seen several 'recall towers' that are permement, and very nicely done, about a 4' square shed almost 7' high, with a pen on the side with a funnel in it, and several birds in the tower and pen. They keep feed and water 365 days year round, its a place that raises field Brittanys.